FULL RP Name(s): A: MPF-H VAU-EXP OfC-II Molfar, MSO MACE 02 3471, HECU FH C-9 PVT Shturmn't, BB RU 03 Shturmn't 2 electric boogaloo
Discord Username: A:gvaniovnov
Steam ID: A:STEAM_0:1:71293518
Workshop Link:(If applicable) A:N/A
What is your suggestion? A: First of all, I appreciate the work that got put into the medbeam, but in my opinion, it does not cover all the bases that were covered by the medkit.
1. Flexibility: being a HPS weapon, medbeam requires HELIX to use it for a certain period of time to heal someone. You no longer can switch to medkit, heal, and switch back to your gun, or do anything else. This problem is also amplified by the delay between firing the weapon and the beam actually appearing.
2. Burst healing vs HPS: as a side note to the flexibility issue, HELIX no longer can use their heal reactively. Burst healing brings a target to nearly full health no matter how low it is, meaning if a person begins taking damage, there's a large time window for a HELIX to react and save them, which is not the case with the medbeam as not only it can't out heal a gunfire, it doesn't do much if the target is already low on health.
Burst healing vs HPS problem, is the reason why the Crusader's crossbow is so popular among TF2 medics.
3. Synergy with the rest of the kit: The biggest selling point for me is the medbeam's range, yet it doesn't synergize with the defib, because to revive someone you still have to walk to the body, and then walk back to your position to utilize its range. It's also worth noting that with the medkit, you could instantly heal your defib target to full health.
4. Can't heal and self-heal at the same time: not sure if this is intended, but not being able to out heal cheap damage while healing someone is a large hit to HELIX survivability 5. Not enough reason to use the medbeam proactively: TF2 medic always has a reason to keep his beam at the target to both generate overheal and uber. OW2 Mercy gets higher mobility for herself and can damage boost her target. The only reason for CvR HELIX to keep the beam up is to maximize the time a target can survive under fire (only for the target to get one-tapped by a sniper or a 757 blast) In my opinion, medbeam should instead replace the health dispenser, giving HELIX access to both burst healing and HPS.
How would this benefit the server? A: It was stated that "there's nothing that could be considered a downgrade from the medkit" but in my opinion, the medkit outdoes the medbeam in many scenarios, yet provides a slight help in a few specific ones. This makes it a supplementary tool, just like the health dispenser, and therefore a choice should be made between the tablet and the medbeam to maintain the HELIX's kit strength
+1
i think the benefits of the health dispenser are arguably outshined by the CWU ration dispenser due to the overhealth it gives, the 50 credits you have to pay and the frequency you see them are only tiny setbacks but the frequency argument could still also hold true for the health dispenser
Firstly, the role of the medbeam and medkit is exactly the same, having both would be really redundant and most people would just use one or the other.
While I do agree that the burst healing can be more effective in a number of scenarios, the medbeam has a number of extra bonuses that I think largely make up for it. First of all, you can heal from a distance, allowing you to heal people while in cover. While it isn't as fast as before, I don't think it's really a relevant downgrade unless you rely on quick switching constantly.
I would argue it synergizes pretty fine with the kit. Reviving people is extremely powerful, and should require you to be right in someone's face. And just because the more powerful is riskier to do that the less powerful thing doesn't mean things are "unsynergized."
You can self heal and heal at the same time, it's an entire perk. Honestly I think this is a good change because self healing and healing at the same time is pretty powerful (also team player no longer affects self healing so it was never supposed to be as effective as it used to be). It actually encourages more variance in skill selection, because they actually do different things. Before I could never justify mirror because team player got the job done better, now they both have their own use cases. (And all 3 healing perks combo together for some nuts healing)
I don't really get what you mean by there not being a reason to "proactively heal people." The reason you heal people is so they don't die. It's exactly the same as before.
Also why tf does everyone hate on the health dispenser? That shit is SO good. Like 250 health when you interact with it (not counting perks) and it doesn't require a medic to be there. Whenever I'm not playing medic and I see one of those plopped down somewhere it can be just as good as a full medic provided the location hasn't been swarmed.
imo the medkit is superior to the healing beam because it's actually in Half Life 2.
I'm still waiting to get a proper measure for it in-game though. On the other hand, the Heal Beam and Medkit both fill the same role, which the Health Dispenser does not. Trading it to have the medkit back doesn't make a ton of sense considering that overlap, but if that really is the consensus of HELIX in its entirety then maybe it could happen.
The only way I can summarise your response is "it's a nerf, but a sensible one".
"While it isn't as fast as before": 1 second delay per healing target + 2-3 seconds to reach the same 250 HP you could get instantly by healing someone with a medkit. And yes, I do rely on quick switching. heal, defib, heal, shoot, stick, defib, heal you get to constantly move and juggle your tools around, literally medic doom guy
"And just because the more powerful is riskier to do that the less powerful thing doesn't mean things are "unsynergized.": Not only it's less powerful and takes more time to do, it's "unsynergized" because you have to give up the only strong quality of the medbeam (range) and walk up to someone, and then walk again to a safe position, you have to forfeit your position from medbeam to use defib, "unsynergized"
"You can self-heal and heal at the same time, it's an entire perk": And it synergizes greatly with self-healing while healing someone else, yes, we are talking about maintaining the HELIX's kit strength here
"It actually encourages more variance in skill selection": No, because you have to use mirror now, or die. It encourages more variance only for people who only use the same 3 healing perks with no slots reserved for mobility or damage
"I don't really get what you mean by there not being a reason to "proactively heal people."": Why would I, keep the beam up, leaving myself defenseless in a fast-paced combat of cvr, instead of just having my gun up and switching to healing when I need to? Before the fight, I have no way of knowing which teammate is getting attacked (reminder: wrong guess is 1 second delay before healing + already low hp target with no burst heal), and no way of knowing how fast they die + the current HPS doesn't increase the time a target can survive under fire that much, it's a fast recovery tool, not tf2 medic quickfix
"Also why tf does everyone hate on the health dispenser?" No hate, HP disp is an additional tool that helps HELIX reach targets unreachable due to medkit's range and HELIX's current position. Yet it can't replace the medkit, and is better than medkit only in a few specific situations (just like medbeam)
+1 The medkit felt way better to use and looks better. The medbeam rn just feels like it got stripped from tf2 (No discredit to the devs, it just doesn't look like it should exist in the hl2 genre)
A: MPF-H VAU-EXP OfC-II Molfar, MSO MACE 02 3471, HECU FH C-9 PVT Shturmn't, BB RU 03 Shturmn't 2 electric boogaloo
Discord Username:
A:gvaniovnov
Steam ID:
A:STEAM_0:1:71293518
Workshop Link: (If applicable)
A:N/A
What is your suggestion?
A: First of all, I appreciate the work that got put into the medbeam, but in my opinion, it does not cover all the bases that were covered by the medkit.
1. Flexibility: being a HPS weapon, medbeam requires HELIX to use it for a certain period of time to heal someone. You no longer can switch to medkit, heal, and switch back to your gun, or do anything else. This problem is also amplified by the delay between firing the weapon and the beam actually appearing.
2. Burst healing vs HPS: as a side note to the flexibility issue, HELIX no longer can use their heal reactively. Burst healing brings a target to nearly full health no matter how low it is, meaning if a person begins taking damage, there's a large time window for a HELIX to react and save them, which is not the case with the medbeam as not only it can't out heal a gunfire, it doesn't do much if the target is already low on health.
Burst healing vs HPS problem, is the reason why the Crusader's crossbow is so popular among TF2 medics.
3. Synergy with the rest of the kit: The biggest selling point for me is the medbeam's range, yet it doesn't synergize with the defib, because to revive someone you still have to walk to the body, and then walk back to your position to utilize its range. It's also worth noting that with the medkit, you could instantly heal your defib target to full health.
4. Can't heal and self-heal at the same time: not sure if this is intended, but not being able to out heal cheap damage while healing someone is a large hit to HELIX survivability
5. Not enough reason to use the medbeam proactively: TF2 medic always has a reason to keep his beam at the target to both generate overheal and uber. OW2 Mercy gets higher mobility for herself and can damage boost her target. The only reason for CvR HELIX to keep the beam up is to maximize the time a target can survive under fire (only for the target to get one-tapped by a sniper or a 757 blast)
In my opinion, medbeam should instead replace the health dispenser, giving HELIX access to both burst healing and HPS.
How would this benefit the server?
A: It was stated that "there's nothing that could be considered a downgrade from the medkit" but in my opinion, the medkit outdoes the medbeam in many scenarios, yet provides a slight help in a few specific ones. This makes it a supplementary tool, just like the health dispenser, and therefore a choice should be made between the tablet and the medbeam to maintain the HELIX's kit strength
i think the benefits of the health dispenser are arguably outshined by the CWU ration dispenser due to the overhealth it gives, the 50 credits you have to pay and the frequency you see them are only tiny setbacks but the frequency argument could still also hold true for the health dispenser
Firstly, the role of the medbeam and medkit is exactly the same, having both would be really redundant and most people would just use one or the other.
While I do agree that the burst healing can be more effective in a number of scenarios, the medbeam has a number of extra bonuses that I think largely make up for it. First of all, you can heal from a distance, allowing you to heal people while in cover. While it isn't as fast as before, I don't think it's really a relevant downgrade unless you rely on quick switching constantly.
I would argue it synergizes pretty fine with the kit. Reviving people is extremely powerful, and should require you to be right in someone's face. And just because the more powerful is riskier to do that the less powerful thing doesn't mean things are "unsynergized."
You can self heal and heal at the same time, it's an entire perk. Honestly I think this is a good change because self healing and healing at the same time is pretty powerful (also team player no longer affects self healing so it was never supposed to be as effective as it used to be). It actually encourages more variance in skill selection, because they actually do different things. Before I could never justify mirror because team player got the job done better, now they both have their own use cases. (And all 3 healing perks combo together for some nuts healing)
I don't really get what you mean by there not being a reason to "proactively heal people." The reason you heal people is so they don't die. It's exactly the same as before.
Also why tf does everyone hate on the health dispenser? That shit is SO good. Like 250 health when you interact with it (not counting perks) and it doesn't require a medic to be there. Whenever I'm not playing medic and I see one of those plopped down somewhere it can be just as good as a full medic provided the location hasn't been swarmed.
I'm still waiting to get a proper measure for it in-game though. On the other hand, the Heal Beam and Medkit both fill the same role, which the Health Dispenser does not. Trading it to have the medkit back doesn't make a ton of sense considering that overlap, but if that really is the consensus of HELIX in its entirety then maybe it could happen.
"While it isn't as fast as before": 1 second delay per healing target + 2-3 seconds to reach the same 250 HP you could get instantly by healing someone with a medkit. And yes, I do rely on quick switching. heal, defib, heal, shoot, stick, defib, heal you get to constantly move and juggle your tools around, literally medic doom guy
"And just because the more powerful is riskier to do that the less powerful thing doesn't mean things are "unsynergized.": Not only it's less powerful and takes more time to do, it's "unsynergized" because you have to give up the only strong quality of the medbeam (range) and walk up to someone, and then walk again to a safe position, you have to forfeit your position from medbeam to use defib, "unsynergized"
"You can self-heal and heal at the same time, it's an entire perk": And it synergizes greatly with self-healing while healing someone else, yes, we are talking about maintaining the HELIX's kit strength here
"It actually encourages more variance in skill selection": No, because you have to use mirror now, or die. It encourages more variance only for people who only use the same 3 healing perks with no slots reserved for mobility or damage
"I don't really get what you mean by there not being a reason to "proactively heal people."": Why would I, keep the beam up, leaving myself defenseless in a fast-paced combat of cvr, instead of just having my gun up and switching to healing when I need to? Before the fight, I have no way of knowing which teammate is getting attacked (reminder: wrong guess is 1 second delay before healing + already low hp target with no burst heal), and no way of knowing how fast they die + the current HPS doesn't increase the time a target can survive under fire that much, it's a fast recovery tool, not tf2 medic quickfix
"Also why tf does everyone hate on the health dispenser?" No hate, HP disp is an additional tool that helps HELIX reach targets unreachable due to medkit's range and HELIX's current position. Yet it can't replace the medkit, and is better than medkit only in a few specific situations (just like medbeam)