Small nerf for Mace or Small buff to SU to counter Mace.

Hong Kong  Senior Infrastructure Moderator Server Administrator VIP 7 Feb 20 at 12:18am
(30 Jan 20 at 2:31am)Bel1ve. Wrote: I added su cause they can pretty much 1 tap headshot unions while they are disguised or not. And 3 tap any unit if they body shot mostly. Which I said (I think) IMO is stronger than it should be.

And tough luck buddy but I am fairly certain the game is not based on realism.

Imo it’s due to the insanely short deploy time of weapons whilst uncloaking.
An SMG that deploys within 0.5-1second, take the P90 for example. With it’s high RPM it can kill just about any resistance class within seconds, giving the resistance member 0 time to react.
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Stalk  VIP 7 Feb 20 at 12:19am
I'd be fine with mace uncloaking for a small amount of time after being shot or them needing to hide every so often to recharge their cloak or w/e, completely -1 to the rest though.
Dodgy  Head Administrator VIP 7 Feb 20 at 12:34am
I think some of you guys forget the part that MACE are invisible, whereas SU are not.

Being able to actually see your enemy is a monumental advantage compared to not being able to see them at all. You’re able to prepare yourself in case your “teammate” turns on you. Not to mention, there’s a multitude of rules put into place that allow you to preemptively eliminate the SU before they can take any action (suspicion, kill feed, ID checking, etc.) None of these mechanics apply to the MACE, making them a more effective infiltration unit and combat unit as well.

Speaking from a vehicle division perspective, MACE have a distinct advantage in stealing vehicles over SU. In most cases, SUs will have to bypass a number of different Combine guards that will ID check them (which they may or may not succeed) and have to manage to enter the vehicle undetected to hijack it (which, again, they may or may not succeed in doing so). On the other hand, in nearly every case, MACE are **guaranteed** at least an entry into the vehicle to perform their hijacks. You cannot guard against or prepare for an enemy you cannot even see. How can you defend against a unit that you cannot see whilst also trying to repair a vehicle? I’m aware that (at one point at least) Rebels were supposed to receive some sort of method to detect the MACE, but I’m not too sure what happened to that concept.

Now, to address the actual suggestions. The cloak timer concept seems very interesting, as well as being able to cause a MACE to uncloak by damaging them. Perhaps this would encourage them to take alternative routes instead of running headfirst into the enemy. As for the thermal goggles, I don’t believe these would be a necessity if we implement the aforementioned suggestions.

Overall, +1 for the changes.
Codex  VIP 7 Feb 20 at 12:34am
+1 to the uncloaking after being shot
-1 to everything else

Also just because mace recently recruited and they're active, you don't have to suggest for a nerf immediately after getting dicked on. SU will just have as much impact if there were actually 7 of them on.
basically another 'nerf eowa' scenario imo
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Cylean  7 Feb 20 at 12:36am
MACE is cool but it just requires positioning and you can easily kill a group of people.
I think the footsteps thing was a good attempt at balancing things but eh.
I'm only kinda saying keep them cause one little change can make or break the class.
1+/-1 I guess.
the delay for cloaking is cool though, +1 on that.
Prophet  VIP 7 Feb 20 at 12:39am Edited
Now this has been a pretty common issue for a very long time, ever since they first got introduced to cloak sweps to begin with. It was flawed in many ways, both for people using the swep and people being put against it. Many guidelines were made, followed with several updates to the swep, along with multiple cloak addons being tested and trashed away due to the fact it didnt work or because it wasnt as good enough as we would hope.

Normally back in the day, where we could easily detect MACEs due to the noise they made every so often while being in movement, was an ideal, semi-decent way of detecting a MACE or at least, getting a hint that a MACE were close to your proximity, or even back when they got shot they would be slightly exposed which was to be honest a fair trait if you compare that to most games which gives classes the same ability to cloak, there should always be a downgrade to it. Something like that should be considered IF the MACE class were to be nerfed, but shouldnt be limited to only SUs, it should the very least be a universal counter seeing as how unique their ability is and how easily it gets for them to just frag a guy in a couple of seconds while going back to playing Cat & mouse with majority of the playerbase

Bringing in to topic of them being unique, i would fairly say that they do have an advantage of being the most versatile class in the game. No cooldown, no downside to the cloaking ability excluding the fact that you cant use it with a gun or the climb swep, movement speed, it makes them pretty much a perfect class for the majority, and having these many people being enlisted to such a division will obviously bring in questions to what and what they supposedly should be restricted to doing, in this case, nerfing them

I honestly dont have a personal problem with the class, i always seemed it being balanced in the past where we could actually hear some movement from them, but at this point, you cant stop thinking for every few seconds that a random MACE will come up to your back and gun you down in an instant without you noticing or having to think for a second. This is also mainly focused on newcomers wanting to have a good time on the server, i doubt they would last long if they only fought people that could instantly cloak, uncloak, shoot & kill people and repeating the same step every so often. It gets pretty burned out and i refuse to believe to be the only one to see it
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Anti yes  Member 7 Feb 20 at 12:41am Edited
Like what poison said Mace and SU have their strengths and weaknesses.

SU are more effective on the field because they can choose when they want to strike without anything giving them away leading up to it
But infils are harder because they have to blend in
They got long range capabilities with their DMR
but +1 for the delay
Mace are more effective infiltrating because theres no trace of them ever entering or leaving until they finish their task
But they give out a loud de cloak noise when they equip a weapon and if your a decent player with a shield or shotgun you can usually kill them
(im going off of the last weapon packs pull out time bc i cant get on gmod)
not even a day after the deployment. also dodgy do you even realize that almost all these changes except the one about bullet detection would make the class useless, and literally no vehicles get guarded except if its parked and theres a db or if its a kodiak but even then the su's can get snipe the guard from the woods and lockpick it since if the kilo's get out the su can just hop in

#1 Great Wooden Dad  Member 7 Feb 20 at 12:45am Edited
SU are good because they get to choose their battles like any other class in the game?
Guessing your mainly on about the DMR which is the worst sniper/DMRA BUT still a distinct advantage in its arsenal due to having a silencer and SUs also having a SMG from the start? I could wrong on that
I'm with dodgy about being able to see your enemy but when it comes to SUs and Maces I think of them as spies in TF2 so I could be very well wrong or bias sounding

Oh and maces can also silence guns too
(Oh but what about killfeed) it's not gonna matter when the nigga runs out and is fast so they can skeet and dodge quickly
[DEFN] Pyro Shark  VIP 7 Feb 20 at 12:48am
Guys guys just play heavy on tf2 for two hours and you'll learn how to check your back and watch for snipers 24/7 so it basically counters them!!

big brain

Im with the idea of having soemthing whenever they take damage even while invisible they become slightly visible (similar to the spy from tf2) and having a timer preventing the mace from cloaking again right away if they took damage.

Anti yes  Member 7 Feb 20 at 12:56am
woodman im talking about the scenarios when your packed with everyone else and your in the back or any scenario that involves bullets and explosions happening. a good example of this is

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